Medical, Need info on Circumcision, medical cons and pros

Need info on Circumcision, medical cons and pros

Author	Message
Gunnar Bl #1 / 25	Need info on Circumcision, medical cons and pros I need information on the medical (including emotional :-) pros and cons of circumcision (at birth). I am especially interested in references to studies that indicate disadvantages or refute studies that indicate advantages. A friend who is a medical student is writing a survey paper, and apparently the studies she has run into are all for circumcision, the main argument being a lower risk of penile cancer. Please email responses as I am not a frequent reader of either group. I will summarize to the net. ****************************************************************** * Gunnar Blix * Good advice is one of those insults that * **************************************************************** -- **************************************************************** * Gunnar Blix * Good advice is one of those insults that * ******************************************************************
Sat, 14 Oct 1995 04:33:40 GMT

Russell Turp #2 / 25	Need info on Circumcision, medical cons and pros -*---- Quote: > I need information on the medical (including emotional :-) pros and > cons of circumcision (at birth). ... I pity those who hope that medical knowledge can resolve issues such as this. This issue has been rehashed in sci.med time and time again. The bottom line is this: in normal circumstances, both the medical advantages of and the medical risks of circumcision are minor. This means that the decision is left to the religious, cultural, ethical, and aesthetic mores of the parents, at best, or to the habit of the concerned hospital or caregivers, at worst. As (prospective) parents, you should do what you want in this regard and not worry about it too much. In terms of decisions you make for your child, it will have far less importance than many -- such as which schools you choose -- that most parents think about only a little. This question will undoubtedly push the buttons of people who feel that the decision to circumcise your infant or not is a momentous medical decision. It is not. Russell
Sat, 14 Oct 1995 23:37:33 GMT

Mike #3 / 25	Need info on Circumcision, medical cons and pros Need info on Circumcision, medical cons and pros writes: Quote: >I need information on the medical (including emotional :-) pros and >cons of circumcision (at birth). I am especially interested in >references to studies that indicate disadvantages or refute studies >that indicate advantages. A friend who is a medical student is >writing a survey paper, and apparently the studies she has run into >are all for circumcision, the main argument being a lower risk of >penile cancer. >Please email responses as I am not a frequent reader of either group. >I will summarize to the net. I'm very surprised that medical schools still push routine circumcision of newborn males on the population. Since your friend is not a man, she can't imagine what it's like to have a {filter}, much less a foreskin. I guess if American medicine did an artistic job of circumcising every male, then the visual result would be somewhat more natural in appearance... The penile cancer thing has been completely debunked...she must be going to school on a South Pacific island. Tell her to check the Journal or Urology for circumcision articles. I remember at least 1 on an old Jewish man (cut at birth) who developed penile cancer....I mean, if the cancer risk was that great, the Europe who have been circumcising like crazy, too. Teaching a boy how to keep his{filter}head clean is the issue: a little proper hygiene goes a long way - Americans are just too hung up on the {filter} to consider cleaning it: that's just way too much like mastubation. So you have surgical intervention that is basically unnecessary.
Sat, 14 Oct 1995 23:16:19 GMT

aezp.. #4 / 25	Need info on Circumcision, medical cons and pros Quote: >Need info on Circumcision, medical cons and pros >writes: >>I need information on the medical (including emotional :-) pros and >>cons of circumcision (at birth). I am especially interested in >>references to studies that indicate disadvantages or refute studies >>that indicate advantages. A friend who is a medical student is >>writing a survey paper, and apparently the studies she has run into >>are all for circumcision, the main argument being a lower risk of >>penile cancer. >>Please email responses as I am not a frequent reader of either group. >>I will summarize to the net. >I'm very surprised that medical schools still push routine circumcision >of newborn males on the population. Since your friend is not a man, she Money probably has a lot to do with keeping the practice of routine circumcision alive... It's another opporitunity to charge a few hundred extra bucks for a completely unnecessary procedure, the rationale for which until recently has been accepted without question by most parents of newborns. One could also imagine that complications arising from circumcision (infections, sloppy jobs, etc) are far more common than the remote chance of penile cancer it is purported to prevent. Quote: >can't imagine what it's like to have a {filter}, much less a foreskin. I >guess if American medicine did an artistic job of circumcising every >male, then the visual result would be somewhat more natural in >appearance... >The penile cancer thing has been completely debunked...she must be >going to school on a South Pacific island. Tell her to check the Journal >or Urology for circumcision articles. I remember at least 1 on an old >Jewish man (cut at birth) who developed penile cancer....I mean, if the >cancer risk was that great, the Europe who have been circumcising like >crazy, too. Teaching a boy how to keep his{filter}head clean is the issue: a >little proper hygiene goes a long way - Americans are just too hung up on >the {filter} to consider cleaning it: that's just way too much like >mastubation. So you have surgical intervention that is basically >unnecessary. Peter Schlumpf University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Sun, 15 Oct 1995 04:23:11 GMT

Ravi or Deantha Men #5 / 25	Need info on Circumcision, medical cons and pros Quote: >>can't imagine what it's like to have a {filter}, much less a foreskin. I >>guess if American medicine did an artistic job of circumcising every >>male, then the visual result would be somewhat more natural in >>appearance... >>The penile cancer thing has been completely debunked...she must be >>going to school on a South Pacific island. Tell her to check the Journal >>or Urology for circumcision articles. I remember at least 1 on an old >>Jewish man (cut at birth) who developed penile cancer....I mean, if the >>cancer risk was that great, the Europe who have been circumcising like >>crazy, too. Teaching a boy how to keep his{filter}head clean is the issue: a >>little proper hygiene goes a long way - Americans are just too hung up on >>the {filter} to consider cleaning it: that's just way too much like >>mastubation. So you have surgical intervention that is basically >>unnecessary. >Peter Schlumpf >University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign First off, use some decent terms if ya don't mind. This is sci.med, not alt.sex. Secondly, how absolutely bogus to assume that "American's are just too hung up on the {filter}....blah,blah". I think most American's don't care about anything so comlicated as that. They just think it "looks nicer". Ask a few of them and see what response you get. Others still opt for circumcision due to religious traditions and beliefs. Some think it is easier to clean. Still others do it because "Daddy was". Dont' be so naive as to think American's are afraid of {filter}ity. My son is not circumcised, and I can vouch for the argument that it is more difficult to keep clean than a circumcised kids'. Not so much that the foreskin is difficult to pull back (it isn't) but because my son doesn't want to wait long enough for a thorough check for smega or misplaced feces. So, many times it just gets a once over dab. It worries me that he might get an infection due to his lack of cooperation. I am sure, however, that he will be able to handle cleaning under the foreskin himself once he is old enough. Until, there is always the decision at each diaper change...is this the time to clean or can we wait till next time.
Mon, 16 Oct 1995 07:05:53 GMT

Texx #6 / 25	Need info on Circumcision, medical cons and pros Quote: >>>The penile cancer thing has been completely debunked...she must be >>>going to school on a South Pacific island. Tell her to check the Journal >>>or Urology for circumcision articles. I remember at least 1 on an old >>>Jewish man (cut at birth) who developed penile cancer....I mean, if the >>>cancer risk was that great, the Europe who have been circumcising like >>>crazy, too. Teaching a boy how to keep his{filter}head clean is the issue: a >>>little proper hygiene goes a long way - Americans are just too hung up on >>>the {filter} to consider cleaning it: that's just way too much like >>>mastubation. So you have surgical intervention that is basically >>>unnecessary. >>Peter Schlumpf >>University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign As I recall, it is a statistical anomaly because of the sample involved in the studies. I am certain that if it were true the Europeans would be cutting kids right & left. Quote: >First off, use some decent terms if ya don't mind. This is sci.med, not >alt.sex. >Secondly, how absolutely bogus to assume that "American's are just too hung >up on the {filter}....blah,blah". I think most American's don't care about >anything so comlicated as that. They just think it "looks nicer". Ask >a few of them and see what response you get. Others still opt for >circumcision due to religious traditions and beliefs. Some think it is >easier to clean. Still others do it because "Daddy was". I think alot do it blindly because "Dad" had it done. But there are many who get bamboozled into it with the bogus cancer thing. Awhile back some quack told a friend of mine that it would help prevent AIDS. Yeah...Right! (Sarchasm) Quote: >Dont' be so naive as to think American's are afraid of {filter}ity. Oh YEAH ? Scene: Navy boot camp DI: "Son, you smel awful! Dont you ever clean that thing?" Recruit: "No Sir !" DI: "Why the hell NOT!" Recruit: "Your not sposed to touch down there?" DI: "Why ?" Recruit: "Cause thats the eye of god down there, an' your not s'posed to touch it..." This did not happen 40 years ago, it happened 2 years ago. I think Americans are QUITE hung up about sex and the involved plumbing!
Wed, 18 Oct 1995 12:49:31 GMT

Patrick Drap #7 / 25	Need info on Circumcision, medical cons and pros Quote: >Oh YEAH ? >Scene: Navy boot camp >DI: "Son, you smel awful! Dont you ever clean that thing?" >Recruit: "No Sir !" >DI: "Why the hell NOT!" >Recruit: "Your not sposed to touch down there?" >DI: "Why ?" >Recruit: "Cause thats the eye of god down there, an' your not s'posed to touch it..." >This did not happen 40 years ago, it happened 2 years ago. >I think Americans are QUITE hung up about sex and the involved plumbing! Wow that certainly CONVINCED me that all Americans ar hung up about sex. Just one example of something that probably ran in a Hustler mag is enough to convince me. Sarchasm off. ------------------////////////////////\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\------------------ \| Patrick Draper-ZBT We are a nation of laws, not people. \| \| University of Michigan Computer Club \| ------------------\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\////////////////////------------------
Wed, 18 Oct 1995 21:03:50 GMT

Ravi or Deantha Men #8 / 25	Need info on Circumcision, medical cons and pros Quote: >Scene: Navy boot camp >DI: "Son, you smel awful! Dont you ever clean that thing?" >Recruit: "No Sir !" >DI: "Why the hell NOT!" >Recruit: "Your not sposed to touch down there?" >DI: "Why ?" >Recruit: "Cause thats the eye of god down there, an' your not s'posed to touch it..." >This did not happen 40 years ago, it happened 2 years ago. >I think Americans are QUITE hung up about sex and the involved plumbing! Cute anecdote, but hardly indicative of the population. From the responses I've received to that post (all from men, by the way) I get the impression that unless a person is willing to drop down and {filter} whenever the need or desire strikes, then that person is very hung up on sex. With tv programs about "{filter}" (Seinfeld) and "{filter} (again Seinfeld) and with {filter}s being handed out in high schools and with the {filter}age pregnancy rate and the high {filter} rate here in the States, I would not assume that we American's are frightened of sex. Rather we are a bit stupid about it. Healthy {filter}ity does not require flamboyance or promiscuity. It requires responsibility. Deantha
Thu, 19 Oct 1995 03:27:50 GMT

Choreo NetNews Administration Account(Otta #9 / 25	Need info on Circumcision, medical cons and pros Quote: >>Oh YEAH ? >>Scene: Navy boot camp >>This did not happen 40 years ago, it happened 2 years ago. >>I think Americans are QUITE hung up about sex and the involved plumbing! >Wow that certainly CONVINCED me that all Americans ar hung up about sex. >Just one example of something that probably ran in a Hustler mag is enough >to convince me. Well, three years ago I had the opportunity to travel in Europe while I was doing UNIX training for the Canadian Armed Forces in Germany. I had the chance to go to a Roman bath with an acquaintance I met there. The bath consisted of a number of different pools at different temperateures andlevels of salinity. There was an attendant who took care of you as you worked through all of the pools. So what you say? Well, all of the bathers were {filter}. It took some getting used to, but the whole philosophy regarding sex there is different from here IMHO. I spoke with some other Canadians and American at the bath and we generally agreed that if someone tried to open up a common area bath, where men and womem shared changing, shower and pool facilities, and where no clothing was worn in the pool area, it would be dubbed "{filter}ographic", "sleezy", or some other such not-so-nice descriptions. In actual fact, it was a very nice and pleasurable experince. I hope to someday be able to go back, and this time take my wife. Chris
Thu, 19 Oct 1995 06:58:22 GMT

Jim Smi #10 / 25	Need info on Circumcision, medical cons and pros Quote: > >>can't imagine what it's like to have a {filter}, much less a foreskin. I > >>guess if American medicine did an artistic job of circumcising every > >>male, then the visual result would be somewhat more natural in > >>appearance... > >>The penile cancer thing has been completely debunked...she must be > >>going to school on a South Pacific island. Tell her to check the Journal > >>or Urology for circumcision articles. I remember at least 1 on an old > >>Jewish man (cut at birth) who developed penile cancer....I mean, if the > >>cancer risk was that great, the Europe who have been circumcising like > >>crazy, too. Teaching a boy how to keep his{filter}head clean is the issue: a > >>little proper hygiene goes a long way - Americans are just too hung up on > >>the {filter} to consider cleaning it: that's just way too much like > >>mastubation. So you have surgical intervention that is basically > >>unnecessary. > >Peter Schlumpf > >University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign > First off, use some decent terms if ya don't mind. This is sci.med, not > alt.sex. > Secondly, how absolutely bogus to assume that "American's are just too hung > up on the {filter}....blah,blah". I think most American's don't care about > anything so comlicated as that. They just think it "looks nicer". Ask > a few of them and see what response you get. Others still opt for > circumcision due to religious traditions and beliefs. Some think it is > easier to clean. Still others do it because "Daddy was". > Dont' be so naive as to think American's are afraid of {filter}ity. > My son is not circumcised, and I can vouch for the argument that it is > more difficult to keep clean than a circumcised kids'. Not so much that > the foreskin is difficult to pull back (it isn't) but because my son > doesn't want to wait long enough for a thorough check for smega or misplaced > feces. So, many times it just gets a once over dab. It worries me > that he might get an infection due to his lack of cooperation. I am > sure, however, that he will be able to handle cleaning under the foreskin > himself once he is old enough. Until, there is always the decision at > each diaper change...is this the time to clean or can we wait till next > time. According to what I've heard, the foreskin should not be pulled back for cleaning under any circumstances prior to a certain age (puberty?). I believe it was Dr. Dean Edell (who's an advocate of non-circumcision) who said that nature provides for cleaning there... just leave it alone. I wouldn't worry about him getting an infection. -- Jim Smith
Thu, 19 Oct 1995 08:26:33 GMT

Harry Matthe #11 / 25	Need info on Circumcision, medical cons and pros BULLSHIT ! ! !
Fri, 20 Oct 1995 10:04:07 GMT

Steve Hollas #12 / 25	Need info on Circumcision, medical cons and pros \| BULLSHIT ! ! ! CARBURETTORS ! ! ! and MAPLE TREES ! ! ! (while I'm at it) ______________________________________________________________________________ Steve Hollasch Kubota Pacific Computer, Inc.
Fri, 20 Oct 1995 14:56:10 GMT

Harry Matthe #13 / 25	Need info on Circumcision, medical cons and pros Quote: >\| BULLSHIT ! ! ! > CARBURETTORS ! ! ! > and MAPLE TREES ! ! ! (while I'm at it) >______________________________________________________________________________ >Steve Hollasch Kubota Pacific Computer, Inc. According to what I've heard, the foreskin should not be pulled back for cleaning under any circumstances prior to a certain age (puberty?). I believe it was Dr. Dean Edell (who's an advocate of non-circumcision) who said that nature provides for cleaning there... just leave it alone. I wouldn't worry about him getting an infection. B U L L S H I T -- Jim Smith
Fri, 20 Oct 1995 20:14:55 GMT

Texx #14 / 25	Need info on Circumcision, medical cons and pros Quote: >>Oh YEAH ? >>Scene: Navy boot camp >>DI: "Son, you smel awful! Dont you ever clean that thing?" >>Recruit: "No Sir !" >>DI: "Why the hell NOT!" >>Recruit: "Your not sposed to touch down there?" >>DI: "Why ?" >>Recruit: "Cause thats the eye of god down there, an' your not s'posed to touch it..." >>This did not happen 40 years ago, it happened 2 years ago. >>I think Americans are QUITE hung up about sex and the involved plumbing! >Wow that certainly CONVINCED me that all Americans ar hung up about sex. >Just one example of something that probably ran in a Hustler mag is enough >to convince me. >Sarchasm off. >------------------////////////////////\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\------------------ >\| Patrick Draper-ZBT We are a nation of laws, not people. \| >\| University of Michigan Computer Club \| >------------------\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\////////////////////------------------ My source is the DI it happened to.
Sun, 22 Oct 1995 13:55:10 GMT

Richard Steven Wa #15 / 25	Need info on Circumcision, medical cons and pros Quote: >>\| BULLSHIT ! ! ! >> CARBURETTORS ! ! ! >> and MAPLE TREES ! ! ! (while I'm at it) >>______________________________________________________________________________ >>Steve Hollasch Kubota Pacific Computer, Inc. >According to what I've heard, the foreskin should not be pulled back >for cleaning under any circumstances prior to a certain age (puberty?). >I believe it was Dr. Dean Edell (who's an advocate of non-circumcision) >who said that nature provides for cleaning there... just leave it alone. >I wouldn't worry about him getting an infection. > B U L L S H I T >-- >Jim Smith ------------------ Absolutely right. The foreskin will naturally detach from the corona of the glans, where smegma is made, from the child's own play in their prepubescent years. The rections they have at that time and warm baths will suffice. Do teach a uncircumcised son to retract it to pee and to shake it off, also to wash it once a day. Never heard of an infection in a child with a foreskin. And I worked ER for three and a half years. -RSW -- * 515 Maple Street #1 * Without safe and free {filter} women are * * Santa Cruz, CA 95060 organ-surrogates to unwanted parasites.* * * Censorship is unAmerican! Just IMAGINE: Burning All the Churches! *
Sun, 22 Oct 1995 18:00:40 GMT

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