Chelation Therapy 
Author Message
 Chelation Therapy

I've heard of "chelation therapy" being available in most States for
several years now. Apparently it is a very successful method of cleaning
out the arteries, etc.
Recently I rec'd some information re: the fact that it is now also
available in the Tor. area...but that the formula has been modified to
comply with Cdn. standards.
I would be interested to hear if anyone has anything to say on this as to
1) it's effectiveness in the modified form, and
2) where the treatments are available....
3) any general comments on the therapy
Thanks ....Joel

--- Maximus-CBCS v1.00
 * Origin: The Homestead * TORONTO, ONT * (416) 272-4067 * (1:250/626)



Thu, 08 Oct 1992 10:28:00 GMT
 Chelation Therapy

Quote:
> I've heard of "chelation therapy" being available in most States for
> several years now. Apparently it is a very successful method of cleaning
> out the arteries, etc.

        One of the great champions of chelation therapy for many years
was Carleton Fredericks, MD, who had a syndicated radio show based out
of WOR-AM New York. Listening to him describe it and extoll its virtues
was truly a listening experience.
        He had a fatal heart attack a few years ago, and has been off the
air ever since.

        As if I need to add anything, chelation doesn't work, a simple
understanding of biology and chemistry give no cause as to why it could
work, but I'll tell you, the whole idea is just so damn appealing...
but too good to be true.
--
                Craig Werner   (future MD/PhD, 4.5 years down, 2.5 to go)

              (1935-14E Eastchester Rd., Bronx NY 10461, 212-931-2517)
                  "Doonesbury is more important than self-respect."



Sun, 11 Oct 1992 14:38:49 GMT
 Chelation Therapy

Quote:

>I've heard of "chelation therapy" being available in most States for
>several years now. Apparently it is a very successful method of cleaning
>out the arteries, etc.
>Recently I rec'd some information re: the fact that it is now also
>available in the Tor. area...but that the formula has been modified to
>comply with Cdn. standards.
>I would be interested to hear if anyone has anything to say on this as to
>1) it's effectiveness in the modified form, and
>2) where the treatments are available....
>3) any general comments on the therapy
>Thanks ....Joel

Chelation therapy is a very valuable treatment in cases of heavy metal
poisoning and certain metabolic diseases that cause a build-up of
metal in the body.  Penicillamine and British Anti-Lewisite are the
most powerful agents, although EDTA has been used in some cases and
for some metals.  

Some unorthodox practitioners have made bundles of money by peddling
chelation (with EDTA, usually) as a cure-all for just about whatever
ails you.  There is no scientific evidence that it does anything but
empty your wallet when it comes to coronary artery disease, multiple
sclerosis, ALS or most of the other conditions to which it is applied.
Of course, insurance doesn't cover it when used for quackish indications.



Sun, 11 Oct 1992 21:50:50 GMT
 Chelation Therapy

All the 'flamers' and doubting Thomases notwithstanding,  I am aware
of two medical practices in So. Cal. that have literally hundreds of
satisfied chelation patients.  It is used to allieviate symptoms of
blocked {*filter*} vessles, such as angina and claudication (pain in legs
when walking), that would otherwise be treated by bypass operations.
These practices would not have a thriving word-of-mouth business if
chelation were as worthless as some of the recent articles claim.
They have had several hundred satisfied patients over the past six
years (and more (?) before I became aware of them).

In my family there is a diabetic woman who had a bypass in her leg
for a severly blocked artery.  A few months later the blockage was
reappearing and the surgeon was sharpening his knives.  When he told
her "Don't worry, you won't lose your leg.  I once to perform 13
operations on a patient but he still has his leg."  she went looking
for alternatives and found chelation.  She underwent 30 treatments
and had about 30 more a year later and had no more leg problems for
the next 5 years (which is about the usual lifetime of a bypass).  At
the time insurance paid for all this because they were willing to
take a chance on avoiding a $15-20K hospitalization for another
bypass.

Nowadays it's harder to get insurance coverage.  Chelation costs
around $60-$100 per treatment.  But even if one pays $1800-$3000 for
a course of 30 treatments, it's much cheaper than surgery and MUCH
more pleasant.

---Steve Colburn
   UUCP: {spsd,zardoz,oliveb}!felix!colburn



Tue, 20 Oct 1992 11:10:58 GMT
 Chelation Therapy

Quote:

> All the 'flamers' and doubting Thomases notwithstanding,  I am aware
> of two medical practices in So. Cal. that have literally hundreds of
> satisfied chelation patients.  It is used to allieviate symptoms of
> blocked {*filter*} vessles, such as angina and claudication (pain in legs
> when walking)

        The greatest thing about medical fraud is that all it has to
offer is patient satisfaction, and it usually sucessfully delivers that.
        It is a well known fact that given the subjective and mutable
nature of most circulatory complaints, that merely enrolling people in a
study for a new 'heart' drug will result in the subjective (patient feels
better) and sometimes even objective (as measured on a heart monitor)
improvement in as much as 90% of all cases. This is higher than even back
complaints, of which kindness and 'deus ex machina' only improves 70% of
people.  The point is that this high rate of subjective relief not only
complicates studies of potentially useful therapeutic agents (that is to
say, anything that only helps 90% of patients in the study has to be
considered for all intents and purposes, worthless), it all also opens up
a whole growth industry in worthless treatments, since the people who
feel better spread the gospel by word of mouth, when in fact nothing of
any substance was really done for and to them.
        There is no chemical or biological reason why chelation as
currently practiced should work, and not a shred of objective data that
it actually does work. And those who say otherwise are really only guilty
of self-delusion at best and fraud at worst.
        Now if you want to consider 'chelation' not as it is correctly
applied, that is the binding of divalent metal cations like lead, iron,
copper, calcium, and magnesium, but rather the binding of anything {*filter*}
that you'd wish to eliminate from the body, then it's a good idea, and
the whole basis behind the drug 'cholestyramine,' which is an accepted
and legitimate way of getting cholesterol out of the body, and although
it is analogous in theory to chelation, it is simply incorrect to call
cholestyramine binding bile acids (which then have to be replaced from
cholesterol) chelation, but this is what most people think chelation is
doing.  Chelation is in fact doing nothing to these people except eating
a consider whole in their wallet.
        Oat bran, by the way, is the poor person's cholestyramine. It
works almost as well and tastes almost as bad as cholestyramine.
--
                Craig Werner   (future MD/PhD, 4.5 years down, 2.5 to go)

              (1935-14E Eastchester Rd., Bronx NY 10461, 212-931-2517)
                         "I wouldn't have invited me either."


Fri, 23 Oct 1992 08:31:43 GMT
 Chelation Therapy
Quote:

>These practices would not have a thriving word-of-mouth business if
>chelation were as worthless as some of the recent articles claim.
>They have had several hundred satisfied patients over the past six
>years (and more (?) before I became aware of them).

Historically, there have been thriving practices built on all sorts
of nonsense.  Word of mouth and patient satisfaction really have more
to do with the personality of the doctor and the patient than the
scientific merit of the therapy, which in the case of chelation,
appears to be totally unestablished.  Let me counter by asking:
if it is so great, why can't some objective evidence be offered
for all the good it is doing?  Why can't they show angiograms
where the atheroscl{*filter*} lesions have regressed under therapy?
Tis has been done with aother forms of anti-lipid therapy, why
not for EDTA?


Fri, 23 Oct 1992 08:57:34 GMT
 Chelation Therapy

Quote:


>> All the 'flamers' and doubting Thomases notwithstanding,  I am aware
>> of two medical practices in So. Cal. that have literally hundreds of
>> satisfied chelation patients.  It is used to allieviate symptoms of
>> blocked {*filter*} vessles, such as angina and claudication (pain in legs
>> when walking)
>    The greatest thing about medical fraud is that all it has to
>offer is patient satisfaction, and it usually sucessfully delivers that.
>    It is a well known fact that given the subjective and mutable
>nature of most circulatory complaints, that merely enrolling people in a
>study for a new 'heart' drug will result in the subjective (patient feels
>better) and sometimes even objective (as measured on a heart monitor)
>improvement in as much as 90% of all cases.

Then I guess it does work.

Quote:
>a whole growth industry in worthless treatments, since the people who

                            ^^^^^^^^^
                             IYO

Quote:
>    There is no chemical or biological reason why chelation as
>currently practiced should work, and not a shred of objective data that
>it actually does work. And those who say otherwise are really only guilty
>of self-delusion at best and fraud at worst.

Chelation Therapy has been used since 1946 for removal of
plaque-producing calcium deposits and removal of heavy metal poisoning.

Numerous laboratory tests have been performed to show that CT (EDTA)
resulted in slower synthesis and more rapid destruction of
phospholipids, as well as an increased turnover of phosphate.  BTW,
phosphates and phospholipids are important factors in the clogging of
human arteries.

EDTA was shown to remove calcium from the arterial in a study by F.
Walker, Ph. D. and outlined in his doctorial thesis.  Rabbits given EDTA
exhibited significantly less (P=.05) aortic calcium.

Many other studies have been performed supporting this practice, so a
library search is recommended before saying "no objective data...".

--

******************************************************************************
..............With a rose, in and out of the garden he goes...................



Sat, 24 Oct 1992 03:42:53 GMT
 Chelation Therapy

Quote:

> >improvement in as much as 90% of all cases.

> Then I guess it does work.

> >a whole growth industry in worthless treatments, since the people who
>                             ^^^^^^^^^
>                              IYO

        Let me say this just once, hopefully clear.  It has been shown in
countless cardiac studies and is pressed extremely forcefully by the
cardiologist William Frischman, that enrolling people in a well designed
study can improve the conditions of 90% of those enrolled, and that this
90% holds even for people who are on perfectly good medication and are
taken off it and given a placebo designed to have absolutely no efficacy
or claims thereof whatsoever.  Therefore, any treatment dealing with the
heart that only helps (in the short term) 90% of those using it, gives
exactly the same results as something designed to be worthless.
Therefore, by definition and not my opinion, it IS worthless.  That
people think they are being helped by it is just their natural reaction
to tender loving care and should not be easily discounted, but the
treatment itself is worthless.
        By this definition, chelation therapy with EDTA is a sham, it is
a worthless treatment, and it is a fraud.  

--
                Craig Werner   (future MD/PhD, 4.5 years down, 2.5 to go)

              (1935-14E Eastchester Rd., Bronx NY 10461, 212-931-2517)
                      "If I don't see you soon, I'll see you later."



Sat, 24 Oct 1992 11:09:28 GMT
 Chelation Therapy


Fri, 19 Jun 1992 00:00:00 GMT
 Chelation Therapy

Quote:

> Chelation therapy is a *great* idea in theory

        I agree. The only problem is that the gunk in your arteries is
cholesterol, and chelation refers only to the binding of metal ions.
Most people think that chelation is a general term that describes the
binding and removal of anything that you don't want.

        Now both binding resins such as cholestyramine and for that
matter oat bran bind bile acids which now have to be recycled from
cholesterol, so the effect is the same: oat bran bind cholesterol
equivalent and removes it from body.  It is just like EDTA and Calcium by
analogy, but chemically it's not chelation.  It's analogous to chelation.
        Similarly pre-HDL activate cholesterol transferase enzymes that
transfer cholesterol from peripheral cells to form HDL and takes
cholesterol from the periphery back to the liver (where some of it is
turned into bile salts: see above)  It is also analogous to chelation,
but is not properly called that.

        That is why 'chelation therapy' has such appeal. Even though the
entire therapy probably is ineffective and is directed at a problem
totally irrelevant to the situation, it sounds from description exactly
what you would want to do if you could, so people who really want to
beleive, really do beleive, and are helped by that belief.  Most never
had chemistry anyway so they don't realize they're being taken, and most
wouldn't care anyway, because as long as they believe, they feel better.

--
                Craig Werner   (future MD/PhD, 4.5 years down, 2.5 to go)

              (1935-14E Eastchester Rd., Bronx NY 10461, 212-931-2517)
           "My philosophy, like color TV, is all there in black and white."



Mon, 26 Oct 1992 11:56:53 GMT
 
 [ 10 post ] 

 Relevant Pages 

1. Chelation Therapy/Alternative Therapies

2. Chelation Therapy

3. Is Chelation Therapy a complete scam?

4. EDTA Chelation Therapy

5. chelation therapy double blind study results

6. CHELATION THERAPY -- legal is

7. CHELATION THERAPY

8. Unproved vs. Disproved (was: Re: CHELATION THERAPY)

9. CHELATION THERAPY - science references

10. Chelation Therapy


 
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