NYT: Ancient Click Languages
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ejud #1 / 7
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 NYT: Ancient Click Languages
http://www.***.com/ In Click Languages, an Echo of the Tongues of the Ancients By NICHOLAS WADE Do some of today's languages still hold a whisper of the ancient mother tongue spoken by the first modern humans? Many linguists say language changes far too fast for that to be possible. But a new genetic study underlines the extreme antiquity of a special group of languages, raising the possibility that their distinctive feature was part of the ancestral human mother tongue. Adverti{*filter*}t They are the click languages of southern Africa. About 30 survive, spoken by peoples like the San, traditional hunters and gatherers, and the Khwe, who include hunters and herders. Each language has a set of four or five click sounds, which are essentially double consonants made by sucking the tongue down from the roof of the mouth. Outside of Africa, the only language known to use clicks is Damin, an extinct aboriginal language in Australia that was taught only to men for initiation rites. Some of the Bantu-speaking peoples who reached southern Africa from their homeland in western Africa some 2,000 years ago have borrowed certain clicks from the Khwe, one use being to substitute for consonants in taboo words. There are reasons to assume that the click languages may be very old. One is that the click speakers themselves, particularly a group of hunter-gatherers of the Kalahari, belong to an extremely ancient genetic lineage, according to analysis of their DNA. They are called the Ju|'hoansi, with the upright bar indicating a click. ("Ju|'hoansi" is pronounced like "ju-twansi" except that the "tw" is a click sound like the "tsk, tsk" of disapproval.) All human groups are equally old, being descended from the same ancestral population. But geneticists can now place ethnic groups on a family tree of humankind. Groups at the ends of short twigs, the ones that split only recently from earlier populations, are younger, in a genealogical sense, than those at the ends of long branches. Judged by mitochondrial DNA, a genetic element passed down in the female line, the Ju|'hoansis' line of descent is so ancient that it goes back close to the very root of the human family tree. Most of the surviving click speakers live in southern Africa. But two small populations, the Hadzabe and the Sandawe, live near Lake Eyasi in Tanzania, in eastern Africa. Two geneticists from Stanford, Dr. Alec Knight and Dr. Joanna Mountain, recently analyzed the genetics of the Hadzabe to figure out their relationship to their fellow click speakers, the Ju|'hoansi. The Hadzabe, too, have an extremely ancient lineage that also traces back close to the root of the human family tree, the Stanford team reports today in the journal Current Biology. But the Hadzabe lineage and that of the Ju|'hoansi spring from opposite sides of the root. In other words, the Hadzabe and the Ju|'hoansi have been separate peoples since close to the dawn of modern human existence. The Stanford team compared them with other extremely ancient groups like the Mbuti of Zaire and the Biaka pygmies of Central African Republic and found the divergence between the Hadzabe and the Ju|'hoansi might be the oldest known split in the human family tree. Unless each group independently invented click languages at some later time, that finding implies that click languages were spoken by the very ancient population from which the Hadzabe and the Ju|'hoansi descended. "The divergence of those genetic lineages is among the oldest on earth," Dr. Knight said. "So one could certainly make the inference that clicks were present in the mother tongue." If so, the modern humans who left Africa some 40,000 years ago and populated the rest of the world might have been click speakers who later lost their clicks. Australia, where the Damin click language used to be spoken, is one of the first places outside Africa known to have been reached by modern humans. (there is another page....) ej
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Sat, 03 Sep 2005 13:18:31 GMT |
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#2 / 7
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 NYT: Ancient Click Languages
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Fri, 19 Jun 1992 00:00:00 GMT |
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John Rot #3 / 7
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 NYT: Ancient Click Languages
Quote: > http://www.***.com/ > In Click Languages, an Echo of the Tongues of the Ancients > By NICHOLAS WADE > Do some of today's languages still hold a whisper of the ancient > mother tongue spoken by the first modern humans? Many linguists say > language changes far too fast for that to be possible. But a new > genetic study underlines the extreme antiquity of a special group of > languages, raising the possibility that their distinctive feature was > part of the ancestral human mother tongue. > Adverti{*filter*}t > They are the click languages of southern Africa. About 30 survive, > spoken by peoples like the San, traditional hunters and gatherers, and > the Khwe, who include hunters and herders. > Each language has a set of four or five click sounds, which are > essentially double consonants made by sucking the tongue down from the > roof of the mouth. Outside of Africa, the only language known to use > clicks is Damin, an extinct aboriginal language in Australia that was > taught only to men for initiation rites. > Some of the Bantu-speaking peoples who reached southern Africa from > their homeland in western Africa some 2,000 years ago have borrowed > certain clicks from the Khwe, one use being to substitute for > consonants in taboo words. > There are reasons to assume that the click languages may be very old. > One is that the click speakers themselves, particularly a group of > hunter-gatherers of the Kalahari, belong to an extremely ancient > genetic lineage, according to analysis of their DNA. They are called > the Ju|'hoansi, with the upright bar indicating a click. ("Ju|'hoansi" > is pronounced like "ju-twansi" except that the "tw" is a click sound > like the "tsk, tsk" of disapproval.) > All human groups are equally old, being descended from the same > ancestral population. But geneticists can now place ethnic groups on a > family tree of humankind. Groups at the ends of short twigs, the ones > that split only recently from earlier populations, are younger, in a > genealogical sense, than those at the ends of long branches. Judged by > mitochondrial DNA, a genetic element passed down in the female line, > the Ju|'hoansis' line of descent is so ancient that it goes back close > to the very root of the human family tree. > Most of the surviving click speakers live in southern Africa. But two > small populations, the Hadzabe and the Sandawe, live near Lake Eyasi > in Tanzania, in eastern Africa. Two geneticists from Stanford, Dr. > Alec Knight and Dr. Joanna Mountain, recently analyzed the genetics of > the Hadzabe to figure out their relationship to their fellow click > speakers, the Ju|'hoansi. > The Hadzabe, too, have an extremely ancient lineage that also traces > back close to the root of the human family tree, the Stanford team > reports today in the journal Current Biology. But the Hadzabe lineage > and that of the Ju|'hoansi spring from opposite sides of the root. In > other words, the Hadzabe and the Ju|'hoansi have been separate peoples > since close to the dawn of modern human existence. > The Stanford team compared them with other extremely ancient groups > like the Mbuti of Zaire and the Biaka pygmies of Central African > Republic and found the divergence between the Hadzabe and the > Ju|'hoansi might be the oldest known split in the human family tree. > Unless each group independently invented click languages at some later > time, that finding implies that click languages were spoken by the > very ancient population from which the Hadzabe and the Ju|'hoansi > descended. "The divergence of those genetic lineages is among the > oldest on earth," Dr. Knight said. "So one could certainly make the > inference that clicks were present in the mother tongue." > If so, the modern humans who left Africa some 40,000 years ago and > populated the rest of the world might have been click speakers who > later lost their clicks. Australia, where the Damin click language > used to be spoken, is one of the first places outside Africa known to > have been reached by modern humans. > (there is another page....) > ej
Interesting. One thing that occurs to me is that the various clicks are some of the few sounds that can be made completely by the mouth, without breath, and that sound loud enough to carry. Might they be even older? Possibly they actually preceded modern language? Just an errant thought. John Roth
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Sat, 03 Sep 2005 19:29:20 GMT |
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<jgi.. #4 / 7
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 NYT: Ancient Click Languages
Quote:
> > http://www.nytimes.com/2003/03/18/science/social/18CLIC.html?8hpib > > In Click Languages, an Echo of the Tongues of the Ancients > > By NICHOLAS WADE > > Do some of today's languages still hold a whisper of the ancient > > mother tongue spoken by the first modern humans? > > If so, the modern humans who left Africa some 40,000 years ago and > > populated the rest of the world might have been click speakers who > > later lost their clicks. Australia, where the Damin click language > > used to be spoken, is one of the first places outside Africa known to > > have been reached by modern humans. > > (there is another page....)
You _would_ have to tantalize us. > Quote: > Interesting. One thing that occurs to me is that the various clicks > are some of the few sounds that can be made completely by the > mouth, without breath, and that sound loud enough to carry. > Might they be even older? Possibly they actually preceded > modern language? > Just an errant thought.
Believe Chimpanzees smack their lips - don't recall what it conveys. Regards John GW
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Sun, 04 Sep 2005 01:51:18 GMT |
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ejud #5 / 7
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 NYT: Ancient Click Languages
Quote:
> > In Click Languages, an Echo of the Tongues of the Ancients > > By NICHOLAS WADE > > Do some of today's languages still hold a whisper of the ancient > > mother tongue spoken by the first modern humans? Many linguists say > > language changes far too fast for that to be possible. But a new > > genetic study underlines the extreme antiquity of a special group of > > languages, raising the possibility that their distinctive feature was > > part of the ancestral human mother tongue.
(snipped section) Quote: > > If so, the modern humans who left Africa some 40,000 years ago and > > populated the rest of the world might have been click speakers who > > later lost their clicks. Australia, where the Damin click language > > used to be spoken, is one of the first places outside Africa known to > > have been reached by modern humans. > > (there is another page....) > > ej > Interesting. One thing that occurs to me is that the various clicks > are some of the few sounds that can be made completely by the > mouth, without breath, and that sound loud enough to carry. > Might they be even older? Possibly they actually preceded > modern language? > Just an errant thought. > John Roth
Nice errant thought ;-) Probably make sense as it would be fun to make noises with one's mouth. Or even the nice little click sounds are pleasant if you know who is making them ;-) I thoroughly hold to the idea of meaningful communications ~"before"~ we were very big or very human. When i lay down in our dogness group its a given fact that if i make a big noisey *sigh* sound it will be listened to and responded in kind to by the dogs. The meaning apparently in dog language is akin to "relax time". At the sigh signal the doggies relax _noticably_ as if i were talking "dog". And dog sneezes are just like laughing or giggling i think. They start smiling like i told a joke when i fake sneeze. Now if doggies have language why not early hominids? And its somewhat _easy_ to attach a click sound to a command or a request for a dog to learn. WHy not hominids? Of course hominids ;-) click click!.....i lost my clicks! Clicks are valuable or so it seems. LOL! ~ej~
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Sun, 04 Sep 2005 03:34:48 GMT |
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#6 / 7
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 NYT: Ancient Click Languages
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Fri, 19 Jun 1992 00:00:00 GMT |
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Philip Deitike #7 / 7
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 NYT: Ancient Click Languages
Quote: > http://www.nytimes.com/2003/03/18/science/social/18CLIC.html?8hpib > If so, the modern humans who left Africa some 40,000 years ago and > populated the rest of the world might have been click speakers who > later lost their clicks. Australia, where the Damin click language > used to be spoken, is one of the first places outside Africa known to > have been reached by modern humans. > (there is another page....)
Well I guess Gisele knows where the Kinght sequences came from. Indeed these sequences have been analyzed and they root into the baika at great depth, just as the !kung also do. Putatively the Biaka were clickers until recently. I wonder how Vince Sarich and his language MRCA for all humankind going back to 1 mya sit with this, lol. Or Mr Klien who beleives that language appeared over a thursday night campfire some 40-50 kya. Even in Paabo's time line these groups diverged from each other close to 80kya and along my time line close to 140 kya. See, now I always have to say don'tcha know when you have one demagog predicting the world was made in 7 days and another saying it been here forever, somewhere in between reality sets in and needs to take hold. Clicking is very useful for communicating while hunting over non- click languages, clicks can be made to sound like insects, like grasshoppers or the sounds that small innocuous birds make. I use a clicking noise to call my dog, it works very well. The other day a squirrel (public enemy #1 around these parts) came up to my window while it was open. Rather yell I made 4 or 5 clicks that I use to call my dog. She came running right to the window with out seeing the squirrel and the squirrel had to wonder why this dog came suddenly running around the corner charging at it, close call for the squirrel. I would argue by mixing a variety of sounds a communicator can disguise his communication in natural sounds that only someone who is raised to understand these sounds could cipher. Certainly they add to the prospect of earliest specific humans as organized hunters from the early onset versus scavengers as a primary or sole source of nutrition, such languages would be geared for large prey. Human language in terms of complexity probably appeared with modern humans as they expanded out of africa. However, this is not to say other hominids did not have language, the complexity of languages of other hominid species were geared for the cognative predispositions of those species. The 'click' languages as >100,000 years divergences show just how different other hominid languages might have been from human language when they once again overlapped in range. It is even possible some of the modern sounds of language were borrowed from these regional hominids; however more than likely humans and non-human hominids has great difficulty commicating with each other, probably more difficult than we would have understanding a click language. I should remark the Knight sequences have been on the database for some time without a paper to go with them, these sequences root into and deepen the africa sequences. They set the stage for a multiwave expansion in africa, much of what I see lends me to beleive that they expanded from the region of the northern congo region eastward to kenya and later southward to where the !kung currently are. The eastern populations appeared to have been displaced by the 'explosion' that accounts for the vast majority of the african and the worlds populations with the force spread both westward and eastward from central african republic, nigeria and niger. I differ with the conclusion of these authors, I think that the original expansion in africa sent a few small slow growing groups eastward into melanesia and australia. These were later followed by the explosion. The click speakers in africa may be a product of the early wave, and largely they genetic 'footprint' has been diluted. When Paabo and others make these statements about when folks left, one has to remember that they tend to use mean pairwise differences and the argument is whether a branch statistically exceeds the depth expected from the mean depth of other exiting branches, whether or not these were earlier. With the addition of the andaman a case could be made that a small subset left africa earlier, but not so much earlier that the would appear as significantly different and given that the expansion of other lines and exclusion of these early lines may not be wieghed adequately in the analysis. In any case the 40 kya exit time is not only late, but outrageously late, and current evidence disproves this late exit time. If click languages did migrate out of africa, on might expects exit times of 70 to 140 ky.
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Sun, 04 Sep 2005 05:59:20 GMT |
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